I wish to remain anonymous at this present time. (Edit: Author is now sharing their identity: Darrin MacDonald, New Brunswick, Canada)
Regarding the posted letter of: Friends Letter to Overseers and Workers. Friends’ Letter to Overseers and Church
I agree with the direction of the letter. I applaud the ambitions of our concerned friends and fully support the need for real change. Have for many years. Thank you for speaking out.
However, I would ask the church to read and consider the included attachment and see where we have gotten to in our generation.
Ask yourself where God fits into this manmade structure?
Ask yourself who is the greatest in the Kingdom?
Examine the honesty and transparency of these leaders, and those who so strongly support their role in the framework.
These same three men in power are fighting to every extent to hold control, including continued threats to all who wish to even be aware of the crisis we are in. They are holding the support of most workers and elders in our region. Every evidence points to the need for their removal.
Who has chosen the chief overseer?
Who has chosen the other overseers?
Who has chosen the elders?
Some workers are chosen by God.
Some workers are volunteers.
Perhaps some elders are chosen by God, but in our experience, elders are chosen for convenience. In our area, a known pedophile was chosen to be an elder. Some are blessed by God. Some are not.
The responsibility of making changes in the operation of our “Truth”, must be left to God. Leaving this in the hands of selected people will be the wrong direction. We do not want a manmade worship. We worship God. Discussions and decisions must include all members, who wish to participate.
God’s beautiful “friends” should not be considered a “lower place”.
Remember how Jesus felt about the child in their midst.
Barry, Ray and Dale have been asked by this group to “Humbly take the lower place”. I plead for us as a people to get away from “higher” and “lower place”. To work to become one. These three men cannot hold any place in the ministry. As long as their name is on the list, they are holding the money and authority. Almost all, if not all, other workers and elders will adhere to their authority – whatever lesser level of management we or they pretend they are filling.
These three named men are currently holding discussions at Ellershouse Convention grounds in Nova Scotia, Canada.
This may be an opportune time for this growing group of supporters of Truth, to move beyond the posted notice requesting them to take the “lower” place and ask them to leave the work completely.
This will open the door for restoration of God’s true ministry.
Thank you. For your consideration and part in this needed change in our direction.
Thank you for speaking up.
Anonymous
Management Pyramid
Also Known as a Hierarchical Structure
Following is the management system the “Truth” has grown into in the past one hundred years.
Chief Overseer.
- Male only.
- Absolute authority over all workers, friends, meetings, conventions, decisions etc. in a very large geographical area, including large parts of countries and multiple countries.
- Holding large sums of money.
General Overseer.
- Male only.
- Reporting directly to Chief overseer.
- Authority over all workers and friends in same geographical area.
- Authority to make some decisions without consulting above management.
- Holding large sums of money.
Regional Overseer.
- Reporting directly to general overseer and in some cases chief overseer.
- Authority with consultation and approval from above management over all workers and friends, meetings decisions etc. in a smaller geographical area. May include one or several provinces or states.
- Authority to make lesser decisions without consultation of above management.
Senior brother workers
- Reporting directly to regional or general overseer.
- Willing to promote and enforce any and all direction received from senior management.
- Given field responsibility and responsibilities over tasks. Travel tickets, vehicle arrangements, convention management etc., hall bookings, etc. (Authorized to delegate to a junior brother).
Junior brother workers
- Reporting directly to senior brother or companion with field responsibility and receiving/taking all instruction.
- May be given responsibility to manage a convention during preparation, etc.
Senior sister workers
- Receive all direction from Brother workers, senior or junior.
- Assigned field responsibility.
- Assigned responsibility during convention preparations of domestic tasks, (cooking, laundry, cleaning).
- Assigned domestic responsibility during conventions. (Dining area, laundry etc., sleeping)
Junior sister workers
- Receive direction from all senior sister and brother workers.
- Receive all directions and planning from companion with field responsibility.
- Assigned responsibility during conventions over domestic tasks.
Elders
- Responsibility for meeting in the home, over an appointed church.
- Receive all direction from field workers or any level of workers above.
- May or may not be included in meetings of workers where local planning involving meeting, convention changes etc. are being considered.
Elder’s wives
- May be included to have a seat in worker meetings considering local meeting decisions.
Deacons. (No real named position)
- Male in a meeting appointed to be second to the elder of the church.
- Will fill in as the elders role when elder is not available, and will be consulted on small meeting changes etc.
Privileged friends
- The friends that hold a greater importance to the workers.
- May be built on a genuine friendship.
- Will be included in some worker information not shared to the general church.
- Will only exist where the workers are gaining some privilege. (Usually based on giving of funds, usefulness at providing work or other needs at a convention, open home for use, mail management etc).
Friends
The men, women and children that make up the church, meetings, conventions etc.
Money flows to the top.
Authority flows from the top.
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I wonder if the RCMP would have any interest in knowing the whereabouts of these 3, or if that is premature?
I’m sure you’d take great pleasure in informing the RCMP. Perhaps you should. It might make you feel better.
Perhaps you should enlighten the RCMP.
I would take great pleasure and satisfaction in reporting pedophiles or those who cover for them!
They have power and vast amounts of money. Why would they step down? They have great pride in how they are worshipped. The humility of a servants heart left them many years ago. They rule with FEAR and a well built support structure. Their support structure, take pride in their favored position. They also fear that salvation will be taken from them if they challenge these super disciples.
Possibly if these men leave they will take vast amounts of money with them, sacrifice made by the friends given for Gods work who sit at the bottom rung of the ladder of hierarch.
They manipulate Gods word to support their works. They have made a mockery of the gospel of love lived by Christ.
GOD WILL NOT BE MOCKED. The day will come for these men as they stand before Christ.
The day will come for all men. And women.
Sad friend, you are very sound with your assessment and once again, nothing more needs to be said. Thank you for speaking the truth.
The ‘Management Pyramid’ is spot on!
That pyramid looks like organized religion to me!
What does it mean to “restore God’s true ministry?” If men can’t accomplish the change, then how does this happen? And why didn’t God keep it?
Well from what I’ve seen oft times the “privileged” are the Elders. (you be loyal to the king and I’ll give you place) these will be the busy bodies…those that run to the workers and tattle of the weightier infractions like bangs and tvs…the stuff important to the Pharisee.
I honestly get a little confused by these types of statements. In 4 decades of going to meetings, I’ve had something like 20 different elders. I cannot think of a single one that ever caused any problems for me, or tried to exercise any power & influence over me or someone I knew. It seemed to me that they had a philosophy of “live and let live”, and weren’t really bothered by the more trivial things. Sorry to hear that hasn’t been everyone’s experience.
Even with older workers, I’ve only had very limited negative interactions. Most have been very gracious, accommodating, and not looking for the position.
Maybe it’s just my personality, or maybe the areas I’ve lived (West and Midwest), or maybe I just have been lucky?
My apologies. Sorry. I used a rather broad brush on the Elders. Most of mine in 5 decades have been wonderful. I have seen a couple though that are exactly as I originally described. Thankfully no longer in our field. Glad your experience has been positive.
Count yourself Lucky. I had two elders when went to Jail for extended periods of time. Not light infractions of the law. One elders wife told me I shouldn’t go to college because I had a husband and he would provide. One elder who was so infatuated with me it gave me the creeps. Oh and I live in the Mid West also. I don’t flinch at Gods word. I’ve stayed steady to God. Workers and friends, not as much. I’ve learned not to trust people and what they proclaim.
I think you represent the majority.
“I plead for us as a people to get away from “higher” and “lower place”. “ First thing with ANY transparent organization is to make the financial statements known. Money goes directly along with power. It is that simple. Money separates the higher and lower classes. It is very peculiar that Ray and Barry keep the millions of dollars at their disposal such a closely guarded secret. Why can’t they expose the books? The money is not theirs. Do they think that they really rule? Just wondering.
Money and unquestioned and unchecked power absolutely corrupts. Look no further than Dean Bruer, or any other dictator. Nobody should have, or even want, unmitigated control of EVERYTHING unless they have something to hide.
I believe our current situation has very little to do with a widespread and coordinated abuse of power, and much more to do with leaders being very uncomfortable and untrained being leaders.
From day 1, our “meeting culture” has taught us all to be willing, uncomplaining, not bringing attention to ourselves, in essence “fitting in”.
Most move into positions of leadership (eldership, a more responsible older worker, someone with some financial oversight) not because they are seeking it out, but because someone asked them to…or, because someone died, moved, or was no longer capable.
Therefore, most “elevated status” individuals don’t want it, are uncomfortable making decisions that affect the entire group, and have very little experience (if any) leading a group of people.
This then leads to:
– discomfort or defensiveness when receiving criticism or suggestions (especially when under pressure)
– default position is to maintain the status quo
– less likely to call out others who are engaged in questionable activities.
I don’t know what the answer is, but feel that we need to focus more on realistic checks and balances that are scripturally sound, and much less on complete elimination of any hierarchy. This seems impossible, as it spontaneously occurs even in nature when you take a random assortment of animals and put them into a group.
Realistic Optimist, this was a really well thought out post. Thank you for writing this. I agree 100%. I just can’t see that either eliminating “hierarchy”altogether or conversely putting in a bunch of education requirements and checks and balances is going to solve anything. These kinds of things just add burdens to those seeking to do right and be honest, and give more cover to those who are otherwise. It’s really unfortunate that CSA/SA situation ended up the way it did. Because it’s caused questioning of everything. What I think is going to happen is that people are going to have their eyes wide open, and they are going to speak up more readily, and they are going to offer to help more often.
–
I remember one time when there was a sister who had to go to the hospital and the bills ended up being astronomical. Her companion was just fraught with worry, you could see it on her face. I know there were different ones sending money, at least from our meeting. But then someone with a knowledge of the medical administrative system came forward and asked if he could manage the situation and see if he could reduce the bills. The sister was so relieved.
–
I just think this is a true manifestation of the working of the Holy Spirit – when people feel moved to help those who are in need, no matter what place they are in and whether or not they should have known better.
Realistic Optimist, you state, “ Most move into positions of leadership… not because they are seeking it out, but because someone asked them to”. Back when Jesus walked this earth those that were with him wanted to be seated near him. In any field of endeavor there is ALWAYS competition for advancement and recognition. Being in the work is no different. There are those that want to be in leadership. Saying , “ …most “elevated status” individuals don’t want it, are uncomfortable making decisions,” is absolutely incorrect. Individuals seek what they want whether it’s to be in a specific foreign country, or leadership. They do not just “end up there “. Or, at the least, that would be a rare occurrence. This is a little inside baseball from one who has seen it.
Realistic Optimist: there is definitely some wisdom in your post, thank you for it. As I go through my mental Roladex of the brother workers I know, most of them fit in the category of humble guys who aren’t power seekers. Probably 80% of them. “no reputation, with Jesus I go”. Most of the workers imbody this.
The fact that 20% of them perhaps DO enjoy power and influence, though, is where checks and balances and ‘councils’ are useful (again I am agreeing with Realistic Optimist). Copied from a different thread, related to checks and balances: “Businesses accomplish this with a board of directors. The US government accomplishes this, in part, by having 3 branches of government to balance out interests. Churches accomplish this with having an elder board for overall direction, and maybe an administrative committee for overseeing finances. So… how does this fellowship want to accomplish ‘checks and balances’? That is where the proposal of a council comes from.”
Another wise point in your post is that virtually NONE of the workers have had the advantage of leadership training. Be that leadership training, change management, performance management, harassment training (that’s so important this day in age that we go through it annually at my workplace). They aren’t exactly set up for success from the perspective of leading a group of people. Not to mention, no formal training on how to read/interpret the bible. Which is why so many of the messages from the platform are allegorical expositions on a single verse..
Traditionalists in the fellowship might say, “yes, but God didn’t intend for us to be trained in the same manner as business leaders and wordly preachers – we are different!” I say, training and godly zeal are not diametrically opposed. You can have both. We should be both.
I thought the Holy Spirit was supposed to lead, thought we were supposed to have a Spirit led ministry .Now people need leadership training and all kinds of other training. Sooooooo these professionals know more than the HOLY Spirit, who according to Jesus will lead us into all truth.
Can we just be honest and admit that the Holy Spirit would have given these workers/ overseers direction, they were unwilling to take it. As time passed with no obedience perhaps God gave them over to more sexual impurity as it says in Romans.
We don’t need leaders with more professional knowledge, we need humble people who will allow the Spirit to lead them.
Jesus mentioned the least. Look for humble honest people who will do what’s right, no matter what it costs.
I’m afraid I disagree with this premise, The Holy Spirit is no substitute for education. That makes no more sense than saying “I don’t need a seatbelt, God will protect me” That’s ridiculous. The world doesn’t work that way. God provided us a brain, we need to use it, that includes education and training.
RSRichy, I would say that the Holy Spirit is very well educated, He knows everything and can do everything, and He also knows exactly what’s going on.
Tell me one professional that can compete with Him.
However I get it, I wasn’t trying to diminish professional help.
Let’s face it though, you have a child that’s been abused, are you really going to be satisfied with an overseer that tells you to wait until he gets a professional opinion, on what to do?
God did give us a brain, and that brain would tell us to remove the abuser and inform people so that he cannot harm anyone else.
Having done that, by all means seek professional counselling for the victim first and then for the abuser.
Then, sit back and contemplate why all this sexual deviance is going on in this ministry and fellowship.
Then back to our highly educated Holy Spirit, to learn the changes that need to be made to avoid these kinds of atrocities.
Hopefully, He hasn’t given you over to a reprobate mind and there is still time to repent.
I am not trying to be contentious, common sense dictates removal of such a person.
Personally I don’t believe that common sense is lacking here, there are for sure other reasons why these things are not handled in the right way. God knows, and so do others…………………
ENOUGH. It needs to STOP
On a lighter note yes, please wear your seatbelt, but know this, if it’s your time to go, it’s not gonna help.
Hello No Confidence, thanks for the reply. As it relates to the current crises, are you suggesting that the workers should NOT take MinistrySafe training because it diminishes or interferes with the role of the Holy Spirit?
Someone can avail themselves of relevant tools & knowledge related to their calling, AND be led by the Holy Spirit. Perhaps you know people like that in your field. Do you know any doctors or lawyers that are professing? I’ve known a few. Does it diminish the work of the Holy Spirit in their lives? I don’t think so.
Perhaps you think education is fine except when it comes to God’s servants? I would argue that their calling is no different. For example, workers going overseas make sure they understand the culture and learn the language of the country into which they are going. They want to be well-equipped for the work that God has for them.
No Confidence, I think your beef is with the formality of the training. You associate formal training/education with the way the ‘world’ does things. The way I was brought up in the Truth makes me think that way as well, but I’ve tried to think differently about that recently. Because workers are ‘trained’ whether we want to use that term or not… I heard one worker call the mentoring of the older companion > younger companion an “in-service training program”. I like that. You know, Paul was well-trained. As a Pharisee, his education would have involved learning Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek, as well as studying Jewish law and theology. Additionally, being a Roman citizen, Paul would have likely received a broader education that included knowledge of Greek philosophy, rhetoric, and literature. He often drew on his education and rhetorical skills to articulate complex theological concepts and effectively communicate with diverse audiences. Paul was pretty effective, in the work of the Lord (a huge understatement) – AND was led by the Holy Spirit.
To summarize: someone can avail themselves of relevant tools & knowledge related to their calling, AND be led by the Holy Spirit.
JEF,
What threw me off was, “ administrative committees, 3 branches of Us Government, councils. It all seemed an overkill when God is all knowing and all powerful and He is on our side, ( if it is our desire to do His will”).
I apologize, I do agree with what you are saying, for sure, I wrote in haste and should have been more clear.
I am so sick of hearing overseers write that they weren’t aware, that they didn’t understand, and now since professionals have schooled them , they will do better.
The Holy Spirit would have directed them in the proper course to take, their own conscience would have, without professionals.They knew!!!!!!
Not saying that professional help is not appreciated when it can be helpful. Just didn’t think overseers needed professional help to put pedophiles out of the ministry .
Hope we are still friends😊
I think the point that No Confidence raises, is simply this – we should not need professional courses to understand what is morally right or wrong. These overseers are well aware of right and wrong, just as you and I are. What’s more, they have committed their lives in preaching Christ’s gospel and Gods Holy Spirit supposedly drew them into the work. Sadly it has left them due to their own self importance.
There is a place for professional tuition which will enable better people management, but it is not what will enable discernment of right and wrong.
Even our under world know it is unacceptable to abuse a child.
Discernment, thank you , yes that is exactly what I’ve been trying to say. We all know it is horrendous to abuse a child, no professional help needed.
Realistic — one more thing. You noted,
“…even in nature when you take a random assortment of animals and put them into a group.”
People of Christ are not a random assortment of animals.
The trouble with professing ignorance is the way over use of analogies, and not relying on the actual Word of God. And, simplified ignorance makes it very easy for mass control.
Reliance on Christ is an individual option and will destroy the opportunity for mass control. That is why Christianity is so powerful and beautiful. It is up to the individual and their individual relationship with Christ, and a central leader has no control.
Dictatorships hate Christianity. Most will outlaw it. Cults also hate Christianity.
Christianity completely destroys the culture of the cult. The leaders of a cult are made powerless. But it frees the minds of the people! I love Christianity!!!
Realistic — one more thing. You noted,
“…even in nature when you take a random assortment of animals and put them into a group.” People of Christ are not a random assortment of animals.The trouble with professing ignorance is the way over use of analogies, and not relying on the actual Word of God. And, simplified ignorance makes it very easy for mass control. Reliance on Christ is an individual option and will destroy the opportunity for mass control. That is why Christianity is so powerful and beautiful. It is up to the individual and their individual relationship with Christ, and a central leader has no control. PDictatorships hate Christianity. Most will outlaw it. Cults also hate Christianity.
Christianity completely destroys the culture of the cult. The leaders of a cult are made powerless. But it frees the minds of the people! I love Christianity!!!
Elimination of hierarchy is impossible.
Elimination of some sense of competition is impossible.
The best you can do is try to channel and limit it.
Personally, I think the best thing to do for selecting an overseer (or group of overseers) would be Scriptural: start with your list of individuals that have a uniformly good report from many people, then draw lots. There is a clear precedent, and it leaves the final decision to God!
And make it a 5 year term plus a 2IC, then after 5 years, over to the 2IC and draw lots for the next 2IC..
Anonymous and Watchman —
How are what you are proposing Biblical? Very simple, give precedent from God’s word, the Bible. The Word of God needs to be based upon the Bible.
Or, do you want to continue with a man made religion?
If you want “biblical”, make it a two year term, same as Jesus’ two year term.
If you treat the bible as a law book, the problems will never end. If you extract unimpeachable divine principles from the bible and apply them, it might actually work pretty well.
Transparency Needed, no need to be unkind in rhetoric.
In terms of a biblical proposal, An example of this may be found in Acts 15:22 – “Then the apostles and elders, with the whole church, decided to choose some of their own men and send them to Antioch with Paul and Barnabus. They chose Barsabas and Silas, men who were leaders among the believers.”
Another example would be when Judas was replaced as the 12th disciple, Acts 1:21-26. Is says they cast lots – i.e. there was a selection process.
Agreed with Anonymous – hierarchy cannot be avoided, it develops organically in any group.
Anonymous, funny we share the same name lol. We should be more creative.
Not interested in a man-made religion at all, and in fact if I were inclined to make a change for myself, I would be most likely to be an independent hermit off in the middle of nowhere! 😉 I was specifically thinking of Acts 1:
“Then they all prayed, “O Lord, you know every heart. Show us which of these men you have chosen as an apostle to replace Judas in this ministry, for he has deserted us and gone where he belongs.” Then they cast lots, and Matthias was selected to become an apostle with the other eleven.”
It seems this qualifies as a precedent. Let me know if you have read of another/better way that is Scriptural.
Thanks!
Second example (but not for overseers or equivalent) would be the selection of Stephen et. al in Acts 6. This seemed to be an example of the entire group putting forward their list of who seemed trustworthy for this position (which would have surely included oversight of finances). So, precedent for it to not be entirely a top-down directive.
The Bible is not a law book. I have seen enough of those. And, all law books are written by people trying to distort and discredit other peoples words. Pick up a law book and you’ll see. Case after case, man vs man. The Bible is divine and the Word of God. The Bible is the best selling book of all time and it is the word of God. Nowhere near being a law book. Also, Jesus did not have a two year term. Jesus lived His entire life as the Lord, and He still is. Jesus “term”, or rule is eternal, or with no beginning and no end. Jesus is NOTHING like a worker, or any other human being. Read the Bible and pray, otherwise you’ll be swept down stream by the ideas of man. Only Jesus saves. The problems spoken of here will never end, if man’s ideas and actions are the only thing being discussed. Everyone should respect the Lord, read their Bible with zeal and pray. And, don’t follow man and his teachings. It is not difficult. Christ’s way is simple.
This article is bunch of hogwash and detracts from the truth around CSA and SA (which is based in fact). Get real, stop exaggerating and stay with the facts! Chasing after this “side show” is doing disservice to victims of CSA and SA.
My humble suggestion is to look at other Christian denominations and see if perhaps some of them have been able to mitigate much of the CSA and corruption in their groups as possible. Of course 100% elimination is impossible, but there are ways to reduce it significantly. All other denominations have grappled with this same problem as The Friends and Workers have, and other denominations have found better ways of handling it. Perhaps you think some of those solutions ‘aren’t Scriptural’, but I suspect that if you ask those denominations, they can provide solid Scriptural backing for it. And even if not so solid Scriptural backing, is Scriptural backing more important than not raping children? Remember, the Friends and Workers have the highest rate of CSA of any Christian group in the world – clearly something is extremely wrong. So go find Best Practices from other denominations, don’t be so Prideful that you cannot learn from them.
So….are we allowed to have TV’s or not? I’m asking for a friend who is interested in joining our church AND mainly interested in going to heaven, but he isn’t ready to give up his television. I keep telling him, “giving up your television is a small price to pay for an eternity with the friends and the friends ONLY. He asked me if they’d have televisions there (in heaven). I said I don’t know because I truly don’t know. I said heaven would mostly be like an eternal convention with hymn sings with all the friends. Sad thing is he doesn’t like stew either 😦
😊 feels good to smile today
Thank you for all your comments and consideration.
Both in agreement and otherwise.
I wrote this letter July 11th., in response/reply to the “Friends letter to overseas and church”.
At that time I remained “anonymous at this point”, to shield others.
I am now adding my name as the writer and stand firmly behind what I have spoken.
I have spend many days with workers.
Darrin MacDonald, New Brunswick, Canada.