WINGS Note: The authors are all meeting participants. They fear backlash from writing this. It has been sent to all Australian overseers.
29th April 2024
Recently, the overseer of Qld issued a statement regarding a worker who has allegations of inappropriate behaviours with children.
Unfortunately, the overseer’s statement contains misinformation. The statement was published on his behalf via workers in regional areas and then through unwitting Elders to the general fellowship. The overseer has refused to respond to many emailed communications to him from members of the church regarding this matter, therefore we felt that a public response was our only choice to make it known that there are inconsistencies in his statement.
We, the families of some of the victims, would like to correct the misrepresentations. Our information has been obtained from correspondence and a face-to-face meeting with the Detective Senior Constable from the Queensland Police Child Abuse and Sexual Crimes Group.
For those who have ongoing concerns regarding the worker’s alleged behaviour, we hope the following information helps provide clarity.
The overseer’s full statement read:
This is to inform everyone that for the second time XXXXX XXXXX has been investigated by the police and thoroughly so, without any charges being laid and the investigation is to proceed no further. None of the allegations made against XXXXX have been substantiated or confirmed and there is no credible evidence that he has ever harmed a child. So we don’t have any reasonable grounds for restricting XXXXX from attending any meetings.
We address the misinformation below:
1 . This is not the second investigation against XXXXX. The current investigation is a continuation of an investigation that began several years prior.
2. The investigation has not been completed.
3. It is correct that no charges have been laid, however it should also be added that this statement is only true up to this point in time.
4. It is misleading to state that the investigation is to proceed no further. The investigation is not closed, it is ongoing. As new information is continued to be obtained, the allegations of harm to children will be continued to be investigated.
5. While it is true that none of the allegations have been “substantiated or confirmed” to any legal standards of proof, the Police have taken all the allegations from children, their families, and the wider community, seriously. According to the police, some allegations clearly fall within the legal definition of causing harm to children. Unfortunately, many victims are unable, or do not wish to come forward, or do not wish to provide evidence in criminal proceedings. The reasons for this are well documented. This does not make their allegations any less credible.
6. The overseer suggests that there is no credible evidence that XXXXX has harmed a child. The police have a number of allegations and witness statements. Some of those statements and evidence do not meet the prosecutorial standard required for a conviction, however each statement helps provide a clear picture of a sustained pattern of behaviour. Regardless of the information collected by the police, there are also multiple witnesses that have brought their accounts before the overseers and workers. Unfortunately, the overseers and workers have not given credence to the victims. Rather, the opposite is true.
7. It is erroneous to suggest there are no reasonable grounds to prevent XXXXX from attending meetings. The statement does not state whether the intention is in private or public places, however, there are reasonable grounds to prevent XXXXX from attending public religious services. It is actually unreasonable for him to attend.
These grounds relate to; the purpose to alleviate the potential risk of harm to children, and the obligation to keep children safe.
These grounds are based on the legal requirements according to QLD law: Failing to take steps to protect children from sexual offenders is an offence.
- A person in a position of power or responsibility within an institution to reduce or remove a known risk of sexual offending against a child by an adult associated with an institution.
- The failure to protect offence applies if you are 18 or older and associated with an institution that has children in its care, supervision or control.
- You know there is a significant risk that another adult also associated with the institution (or who is a regulated volunteer) will commit a sexual offence against a child or children.
- You have the power or responsibility to reduce or remove the risk but wilfully or negligently fail to reduce or remove the risk.
The grounds to exclude XXXXX from meetings is also stipulated within the ‘zero- tolerance’ policy statements written. This policy was and signed personally by all Australian (except WA) and New Zealand overseers, and issued publicly in 2023
- The correspondence from the overseers’ states that workers will ‘listen’ and ‘believe’ victims who states allegations of child sexual assault.
- The correspondence also says: “There is no place for people who have harmed children in our meetings and conventions; we ask any individual with a history of causing harm, or allegations, or convictions not to attend. This includes public gospel meeting”.
We would also like to remind overseers that some years ago, when XXXXX was sent to labour in SA, the overseer of SA considered XXXXX’s behaviour around children so disturbing, he removed this worker from the ministry. The SA overseer sent the worker back to Qld on the understanding that he would not be permitted back into the ministry. Unfortunately, and possibly illegally, the worker was allowed back into the ministry by Qld overseers. If the behaviour was considered to be a risk to children then, it should still be considered a risk to children now.
While the statement from the overseer insinuates that the matter is closed, it is not. There is no statute of limitations to report child sexual abuse, therefore victims and their families can still come forward when they are ready. We know that the average time for a victim to disclose child sexual abuse is 23.9 years. Men often take longer to disclose than women. Some victims never disclose.
If you have further information about XXXXX, or any other alleged child sex offences, including grooming, and even if you think it is insignificant, please contact Queensland Police, and more specifically, please contact Child Abuse and Sexual Crimes Group. This also includes reporting those who have failed their legal duty of care to report any possible or alleged breaches.
Please also, consider reporting your story to The Brave Truth Australia & New Zealand, so that your information can be added to their database, and you can receive support and advice. Specific contact details for the Detective in charge can also be obtained from The Brave Truth’, ph 0489 994 566.
Signed,
A group of concerned families and survivors.
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Why are the overseers so in the bag with child sexual molesters? Does ANYONE have the answer?
The overseer “…So we don’t have any reasonable grounds for restricting XXXXX from attending any meetings”.
The policy ”This policy was and signed personally by all …overseers, and issued publicly in 2023″
The history … when XXXXX was sent to labour in SA, the overseer of SA considered XXXXX’s behaviour around children so disturbing, he removed this worker from the ministry. The SA overseer sent the worker back…on the understanding that he would not be permitted back into the ministry.
Do people realize what child sexual abuse is? It’s an adult getting their sexual gratification from an innocent child
There are a few overseers that may have the children’s best interest in mind but the vast majority do not! Time and time again child sexual molesters are covered up for by the overseers and released right back in the environment where they previously terrorized. Michigan overseer Jerome Frandle was arrested for this very act. In court Jerome denied his actions, and even denied his responsibility by saying he was not a minister, and therefore he had no duty to report the sexual predator. Jerome was jailed for his scandal and upon leaving jail went right back to being overseer! These men are truly shameless, deceptive and dangerous. Wearing their dress clothes constantly, they are the face of all that is good, while the reality they are living examples of wolves in sheep’s clothing, working hand in hand with the devil.
Why are the overseers so in the bag with child sexual molesters? Does ANYONE have the answer?
@Question, this may seem oblique as a partial reply to your question, but one reason is that overseers tend to prioritize the perspectives of men. They show by many of their words, decisions, and actions that they believe that men’s opinions and ideas are more worthwhile, correct, and valuable than anyone else’s. It’s not a nice thing to have to admit, but I think all of us who know the fellowship well over time would have to agree.
This makes some sense, because the overseers themselves are all men. Empathetic men (and/or men who are subject to checks and balances like in a healthy company, family, or other group) are able to, or are made to, value other perspectives, too. But this isn’t usually the case in our fellowship which has a very patriarchal bent, and no accountability mechanisms as many other commenters have pointed out.
If we understand that an overseer automatically values men’s perspectives over anyone else’s, it’s easier to understand why that overseer makes decisions that prioritize sex abusers (who statistically tend to be men).
It’s hard to see how our fellowship can change in a positive way, until this changes. Also worth pointing out is that men weren’t solely in charge of the early church. A good translation of Romans 16 gives several examples of more inclusive leadership.
Thank you to the families and survivors that wrote this letter. They have no excuse before man, and certainly not before God.
It should be crystal clear to all by now that the overseers and workers and elders and many of the cult members place more value in perps and peds that they do in the CSA victims. Very twisted thinking this outfit has.
Wow. As time goes by, the term “Overseer” appears to mean “Kingpin in a criminal organization”.
Jim, very astute observation — ““Overseer” appears to mean “Kingpin in a criminal organization”.”
From the control of the lower echelons knee breakers to do the dirty work of the kingpin, to the control of the millions of dollars stored in difficult to trace places, yes there are many similarities between the overseer and the kingpin.
The only real difference is that the kingpin has more ethics and will not allow children, or women to be sexually assaulted. Also, the kingpin might actually have more respect for God than the overseer.
Except even Kingpin’s have a code of honor. Not sure if overseer’s have any code of honor. We now have evidence of overseer’s doing CSA to their members kids, SA to their members wives and others, doing adult activities with lady workers, having divorcee girlfriends, viewing porn, and doing whatever else makes them feel good. All this under the guise of being “men of God. What trash.
“The overseer has refused to respond to many emailed communications to him from members of the church regarding (a worker who has allegations of inappropriate behaviours with children)…”
The bottom line is that the overseers are false prophets and false prophets bring a message that is not from God. Their message contradicts what God instructs and ultimately, they produce “bad fruit.”
“They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them” (Matt 7, 15-20).
What fruit are the overseers producing? What have been the results the chaos since the Dean Bruer scandal broke? Was Dean Bruer just a bad overseer, or do all overseers hide what they are doing? Have the overseers been transparent? Have the overseers put safeguards in place? Are the church members questions being addressed? What is being done to address sexual predators being in the work?
The above information shows overseers are still not responsive, still do not listen, and still keep PROMOTING sexual predators, instead of stopping them. This is the fruit of the overseers; “by their fruit you will recognize them“, says the Word of God.
The bottom line is that the overseers are false prophets and false prophets bring a message that is not from God. Their message contradicts what God instructs and ultimately, they produce “bad fruit.”
Word of God: Amen!
Word of God: Excellent! Now, you know what is the result??? Oh, such desperate knowledge! Leaves everyone with No Hope!; No Salvation! THIS is a very bitter truth based on 2 Corinthians 11:13 – :15. And ‘sends us’ disparately searching for what is NOW!
Just give each person, as they disparately search direction!
Ephesians 6:11 – :18 explains just how disparate our very human position IS: Did you know we are standing “against the wiles of the “”devil””, himself??? AS in 2 Cor.11: !?
Ephesians 6:12 Humans are not our enemy! It is :12 – those humans who by the devil which is in them: become our enemies. NO, this is not a weak joke or light banter: this is the very WORD of God which we sooo very eagerly tout; as God very ‘One Only True way’. How very embarrassing for us to actually READ God’s WORD as written and find we have been ‘boonswagled’! We all played the ’exact part’ laid out for us, as we paraded for decades – in front of all our neighbors and friends: We, alone, have God’s true Way!
NOW, as the local news paper, publishes The FBI’s investigation and search for any and all abused and the destruction of unending victims.
Just read Matthew 10:5, :6 with the Gospel :7 to be preached only to the Jews. Jesus, in his very own WORDS records he was only sent to the “Lost sheep of the House of Israel”. That did NOT change as Acts 1: continues with that exact purpose. through Acts 12:. In fact that was still the case 25 years later: in Galatians 2:7 – :9. James, Peter and John ((who seemed to be “pillars”) SAW the Gospel of the Grace of God THAT was given unto me(= Ephesians 3:1-:9)………
WHAT did those who seemed to be Pillars DO??? Galatians 2:7(d) Paul, Barnabas and Titus were to continue with the Gospel of Grace to the “heathen = Gentiles”, AND THEY = ‘the 12 would’ “continue to go to the “circumcision” = Jews = Nation of Israel, only!
WITH what Gospel? .. “:7 gospel of the circumcision which was committed unto Peter. and :8 by he that wrought effectually in Peter to the “apostleship” of the “circumcision” = Jews = Nation of Israel, ONLY.
Oh, God’s WORD: Our Holy Bible ‘cuts straight’ and as Ephesians 6:17 is explained by Hebrews 4:12 : and is explained by Paul in 2 Timothy 2:15 as Paul ‘exhorts’ his “believers” to not be subverted: but to rightly dividing the “word of Truth”!
Yes, isn’t that beautiful?! God’s Word protects us from the wiles of the ‘devil’ ::: BUT ONLY “if and when” we disparately study and seek and learn God’s Word as written! Then as Jesus told Peter in Matthew 16:17; my Father which is “heaven” “”hath revealed it unto thee. Paul also records in Acts 16:12 in the city of Philippi; :14….. Lydia…. – heard us, whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things that were SPOKEN of Paul. Oh, when we disparately study and READ God’s Word as actually written::: God will open our “understanding” and even gives us strength to ex-out ALL false ‘Doctrine’ we have been SOOO “spiritually abused with”.
Why are the overseers so in the bag with child sexual molesters?
Another answer is simply, that many overseers are predators, they look after their own kind, it’s a brotherhood of sorts.😳
That is one of the primary reasons this has gotten so bad with sexual offenses. As soon as one dirty person achieves leadership, then they consolidate their position through other dirty people. They don’t want to be surrounded by clean/high integrity people who will blow the whistle on them. This happens to many organisations. Then it does develop into a “nudge nudge wink wink” brotherhood. That is what we have been faced with for decades.
The culture of “I won’t blow the whistle on you if you don’t blow it on me” runs deep and is probably not fixable at this point.
“I won’t blow the whistle on you if you don’t blow it on me” runs deep and is probably not fixable at this point”.
It is not,
“probably not fixable at this point”, it is no way fixable at this point.
False prophets are in charge, or the devil. That is powerful, not awesome power from God, but still the devil is very powerful. Very powerful!
Do some research on “false prophets” and the parallel between the overseers and false prophets will stun you! They are one and the same lead and controlled by the devil.
It is not something to shrug off, laugh about or think is made up. Do yourself a favor and do ten minutes of research on this subject. It’s very eye opening and scary!
O
Of course it can be fixed. You sound like a God-believer. Most God-believers recognise that nothing is impossible with God. Why do you think it is impossible?
The fix is pretty simple actually, but unlikely to happen.
Well said; “The fix is pretty simple actually, but unlikely to happen”.
That was actually what was meant — the fix is pretty simple actually, but unlikely to happen. Very, very, unlikely to happen.
@watchman, you are so right, God is still on the throne and he is still drawing souls unto himself. Hopefully we all recognize that work in our own hearts and lives. It is much harder to recognize it in the lives of others, but I am reminded of those words- if we walk in the light as he is in the light we have fellowship one with another and the blood of Jesus Christ cleanseth is from all sins. So God is even able to help us feel the spirit of a brother, a sister.
I have been intrigued with reading about Joseph. At the young age of 17, a child he was hated of his brothers and sold into captivity. He wound up a slave in Potiphars house. Potiphars wife tried to get him to lie with her several times, he refused and so he was falsely accused by her. Potiphar believed her lie and put Joseph in prison. And on and on the story goes, but in each affliction he suffered it says that God was with him. Two things stand out to me., first God being with him isn’t exactly what our human minds would think. Our human mind would expect God to keep him from the affliction, but often times it is the affliction that makes the man a true servant of God. The second thought was when was this recorded about Joseph? Did he go a lifetime with most believing he had made a mockery in potiphers house? I believe God finally made the truth known, but it was years after his death. David wrote about it in the 105 Psalm.
@Watchman – just how do you think it will be fixed? Like what do you think needs to be “fixed”. Because, if you read the Bible about Jesus sending out the 70, this way doesn’t have much right about it. There wouldn’t be any “overseers”, there wouldn’t be any ministry like these men have created…because, Jesus sent them all HOME after they preached where he sent them to preach for a short time. So, that means, the ministry will have jobs, homes, and families. Bible studies, will truly be just that…a Bible study nor a Bible meeting
@henoffour Setting aside the system and all the arguments for and against it, the solution to the primary problem with this church is embodied in one word: ”repentance”.
Whether the 2×2 itinerant system is good or bad, that pales in the absence of a repentant attitude. Repentance means being open to examining what is wrong, determining what is wrong, acknowledging what is wrong and making corrective changes. I don’t see that happening at all among the leadership or among the still-many followers who choose to bury their heads in the sand. They resemble the stiffnecked Pharisees more than any other biblical group. When your whole being is wrapped up in pride of being the “only ones”, repentance is nearly impossible.
Keep in mind, I am a current member, and a Watchman with an insider view, at least for now.
@henoffour, you say that Jesus sent the seventy HOME after their short ministry. I see where they came back to him to report their joy in the ministry, I see where he told them the harvest is great but the laborers are few and asked them to pray that the Lord of the harvest would send forth more laborers, but I couldn’t find where he sent them HOME. Maybe it’s because my head is stuck in the sand, or else I have a different Bible? I also question your passion against overseers. What I read is the one who is greatest will be a servant. That’s a pretty good description of the older workers who have the care and mentoring of others, including younger workers and the flock. I have personally never seen them act like they were rulers . Many of them had good advise when asked.
Why are the overseers names not mentioned here? Isn’t that a fact? Why is the name of the person xxxxxx and not spoken plainly?
Likely because Australian has strict privacy laws, and defamation could apply.
The Queensland overseer is well known for his lack of willingness to act on these matters.
Ministry in Australia was warned about XXX 20+ years ago and repeatedly since. S.A had the right idea regarding XXX, pity Qld didnt listen and learn from that.
They’re still not listening.