WINGS Note: Judy, from BC Canada, has been a friend of CSA survivors since at least the 1980’s and is a widely beloved senior sister worker.
We have deleted the story about the alleged recent meeting in Vancouver as we have received sufficient confirmation that it does not relate to a recent meeting. We apologize for any inconvenience or concerns arising from this. Thank you all for your kind responses and for those who have gone the extra mile to confirm this. We endeavour to be accurate, but this time, we were not. Our readers here are so awesome to get on top of this….thanks so much!
My dear brothers and sisters,
After much prayer and letting the Spirit of God search my heart and motives, sadly, I feel I must step aside from my place in the Ministry. I cannot be a part of a ministry that supports the pedophiles and continually ignores the victims of child sexual abuse and other forms of abuse. I am not stepping aside from God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit or His people or the victims of abuse, but just the Ministry.
My health is good, and my years in the Ministry have been dear to my heart. I have been very glad to labour among you on the South Island these past two years.
With many thanks for all you have been to me.
Judy
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Aw, I have known Judy Scheller my entire life! I didn’t realize she wrote that hymn. Thank you for letting me know! I have seen some notes from meetings with the overseers where she has taken Merlin to task.
Judi Hull (509) 607-0320
which hymn did Judy write?
@Archivist – it’s not in our hymnbook, but it’s posted on Exposing Abuse: 2x2s
@Archivist – please forgive, that hymn was not written by Judy S.
@henoffour – That hymn was in fact not written by Judy.
Judy, as well as Shawn Buckley (now deceased), was reprimanded about the year 2000 for what overseers called “operating a ministry within the ministry”. She was counseling victims of abuse using therapeutic techniques such as journaling, and also facilitating confrontations between victims and their abusers. These confrontations were set up so that the abuser would show up thinking that it would be a meeting between them and their victim alone, only to find Judy present, and the victim prepared to declare and denounce their crimes. This work came to an abrupt stop once Judy and Shawn were reprimanded. Perhaps overseers were nervous about what could be uncovered?
A note: the reprimand included Dale Ford, also now deceased. It occurred around 1992. Judy was sent to Hong Kong, Shawn to China to break their ties with victims and perps. It also resulted in the following overseer guidelines, which are quite awful:
1. If someone from outside your field seeks help contact the provincial or state overseer to see if it is appropriate for you to act on it. Then if so considered proceed.
2. Every case to be handled individually on its own merits.
3. Victims are not to excuse themselves with bitterness, unforgiveness etc.
4. Workers are not in the role of therapists.
5. In cases where professional help is needed it might be appropriate to help them find one.
6. It is not appropriate to share any books or literature on the subject.
7. Danger of people becoming dependent on the worker involved.
8. If the victim is a male – brother workers. If a female – sister workers – because of ongoing visits.
9. Disciplining abusers – must be within jurisdiction of the Gospel with no monetary involvement and not to encourage any legal action.
10. Christlike approach is important for both sides – victim and abuser.
Ernest Nelson
Paul Sharp
Jack Price
Alton Mose
Willis Propp
I wasn’t aware of what took place in 1992, but do know that Judy was counseling victims as late as about the year 2000. I guess she never really gave in to the authoritative pressure.
@BGM – and look at that list of names who signed that awful list of guidlines. I mean seriously, the workers are terrible at conflict resolution, are terrible at reminding people that they are not the authority on marriage counceling/financial stuff, etc. Are terrible at supporting victims. Are terrible at dealing with abusers (mostly because it usually turns out that they have big issues they are hiding themselves). The issue dealt with in this letter, and the issues today, are not on the same plain as someone calling someone else “fat” or leaving them out of invites! The sexual abusers lose all rights to fellowship, the first time they lord their need for sexual pleasure onto someone else for gratification – it’s NOT a pleasure for their 2 year old victim, or their 7 year old victim, or their 17 year old victim, or an adult victim either!!
#4 and #7 look like the only honest statments!
So, why is it, when they even recognize they aren’t capable, do they reject all who offer to help, who ARE educated in all this stuff? Or they try to figure out how to twist the information that they get from the educated people, to further HARM the victims. These overseers are SO ABUSIVE! Every single one of them need to just leave.
I’m not knocking Judy (or Shaun Buckley) for trying, I just wish she/they would have had law-enforcement at those meetings too! But, I understand if she did, she would have been tossed from the work. So, she did what she could to try to keep off the radar, and still try to help. Judy has always been a rock, and one us kids loved to work with at convention time too. Always pleasant, always with a smile of thankfulness and welcome.
so protecting “The Truth” is more important than what a normal compassionate and Christlike heart would advise a victim to do in order to heal. It sounds like limitations designed by fear of the actual truth being exposed and as a result a loving Christlike heart is quelled. As far as I understand from what I read about Judy she is empathetic and compassionate and trying to help and being in the Ministry of “The Truth” is inhibiting that from happening ??
see #9…….!!!!!!
we have been drilled and grilled
NOT TO SEEK HELP FROM POLICE OR OTHERS IN CRIMES
Shame on All Workers that have followed this request to the letter! The Law needs to zee this letter…..and we wonder why it never stopped.
@Two cents – Please send it to the FBI: https://forms.fbi.gov/2×2
@Archivist – I’m guessing it has more to do with who’s married to whom.
Merlin’s step sister is Sharon Hoecherl who is married to Gilbert Smith (Gilbert is a former worker/pedophile in California who had meeting in his home). Cases crawling through the courts. Merlin’s mother is married to Sharon’s Dad.
Elise Square is a niece to Dwayne Square (labors in Taiwan, but is from the BC staff), and Elise is married to Aaron Farough who was convicted.
…and so on.
I did not know that is who Sharon Hoecherl married. Merlin has attempted to project a progressive and positive approach to this, but the tangled family/social web in which he finds himself could account for his resistance to true transparency.
When we moved from Ontario to B.C., Judy was in our field, She was so sincere in her welcoming. You felt that you had known her for many years. I truly respect her difficult decision, yet I know that God will continue to look after her. My thoughts and prayers are with Judy.
Oh Judy my heart is breaking. I am so glad to have a visit with you at Glen Valley last summer. To be able to express concerns and be HEARD is what everyone needs.
I left the work for the reason you expressed. I did not know how to preach the perfect way of God and yet be involved with such corruption and dishonesty. I kind of lost my mind for a while there. Took a LONG time to recover from all I experienced. And absolutely devastated and filled with angst. Somehow God got me through. He will be your strength and peace.
I watched the CBC interview. I cannot help but feel the overseers are making one misstep after another. By Merlin refusing to be interviewed he just added fuel to the fire. People would go away with feelings of suspicion and asking – what ELSE are they hiding????? Which is a reasonable question if someone refuses to comment. The damage could have been lessoned if he had answered a few questions. And for those friends to scurry away like rats does us no good either. I really cannot believe how it was handled. What are they afraid of????
I’m with you 100%!!!
Marg Meyer/Magowan
I remember you at Didsbury, when you had come back from Africa and were recovering from malaria. I have often wondered how you fared. Hope you are doing well and happy!
I guess my name doesn’t come up, and I didn’t think to sign it. I don’t know if you remember me, my name then was Arlis Quick, and Roanne Kooy and I came up to Didsbury convention. My heart went out to you, as I think you were still quite down from malaria. If there was more going on, I wasn’t privy to it, being a younger sister worker.
Sharon, thank you for your comments. Please re-read this statement again, though: “I did not know how to preach the perfect way of God and yet be involved with such corruptions and dishonesty”. “The perfect way of God” would not have “such corruption and dishonesty “, would it? The two factors seem to be in complete conflict. The perfect way of God would be absent of corruption and would be totally honest.
You’re absolutely spot on with your assessment, “I watched the CBC interview. I cannot help but feel the overseers are making one misstep after another. By Merlin refusing to be interviewed he just added fuel to the fire. People would go away with feelings of suspicion and asking – what ELSE are they hiding?????”.
Sharon, I did enjoy reading your post.
Another sad day in the midst of so many.
It’s difficult to truly understand the heartbreak that has led to this sister worker making this difficult decision. Judy is obviously a real mother in Israel who cares deeply for the hearts and souls of those around her. This is a lady who has given her life for others and has both lived and preached the gospel storey.
Now, to the shame of those who continue to enable and support pedophiles, British Colombia has lost another noble sister worker. Shame on those 9 brother workers and shame on everyone who has been culpable by turning the blind eye to the pedophiles and a deaf ear to their victims and survivors.
Judy, you have given your life, you have done your best. Your integrity is intact. Thank you.
and yet it took this long knowing all she has known!? She leaves with full support and funds to finish comfortably. I left with no support after giving my youth and my health. I struggle with the thought that somehow her leaving now is honorable. Her life’s work was to bring into fellowship the very thing she is denouncing now and has know for years the abusiveness?
What makes you think she leaves with money? I know for a fact she did not accept money from Merlin. I also know that she supported victims going to authorities. You may have reason to feel bitter but Judy can leave with her head held high. (In my opinion)
I am sorry for sounding bitter. I suppose I have allowed the trauma of some personal experiences to give me that tone. 😔 I am thankful for each one who strives for truth and justice on this earth wherever we are. This is where we are now. May we know love and compassion even as one human to another. Even as God so loved the world… ❤️
John, I think you maybe don’t know, but Judy stayed, because of what she KNEW was going to happen to those who were victimized if she left. She was ‘hauled before the court’ (brother workers) many times…and still kept fighting on.
Please note: the story about the RECENT meeting with the 9 brothers was incorrect and has been deleted.
I couldn’t have said this any better! Judy has always been a beautiful true example of what this fellowship should be. I have known Judy since the 70’s and this breaks my heart as well…so sorry for everyones loss. …My heart goes out to Judy and those who are struggling to do right. Even though I have not gone to mtg for a long time she has akways been my hero.
just read the top of this email of what Judy endured at – hotel????? What the?????? And what hypocrisy!! Judy’s co worker this past year uses quotes from books ALL the time!! Her co worker DEPENDS on others writings ALL the time. She takes what others have said and uses it as her own!! But THAT is ok??? I know another sister worker who uses Winnie the Pooh and Eeyore quotes all the time. That seems to be ok!! This is unbelievable!! As I said in my previous post - WHAT ARE THEY HIDING and WHAT ARE THEY AFRAID OF???
You can quote from or plagiarize anyone you like as long as you’re not speaking Truth to Power. This story is a warning to any worker who wishes to empower the afflicted or afflict the powerful.
”I know another sister worker who uses Winnie the Pooh and Eeyore quotes all the time. That seems to be ok!! This is unbelievable!!” Why is a worker quoting Disney characters? Isn’t there enough to talk about in the Bible? In my 50 years of sitting in meetings there are many parts of the Bible never mentioned. Why is that? But some man made cartoon characters are talked about?
For the sake of transparency and public accountability, a list of names of those 9 brothers who sat as judges of Judy ought to be posted here.
The story about 9 workers and meeting RECENTLY IS INCORRECT
behind every story there is a kernel of truth. Would be interesting how this ‘story’ came out and then suddenly it is not correct. Hmmmmm Have to wonder
For some reason I dont trust these people
Oh my!!!! But I am NOT ONE BIT SURPRISED!!! My name is Marg Meyer. I was Marg Magowan when I was in the Work 15 years. Judy was my companion in the late Nineties one year. She is the sister worker that I admire the most… not perfect… no one is… I am not either.
She was helping victims when we were together. She was honest with me about this and asked if I would like to learn what she had learned. I CERTAINLY DID! So she shared what she could, but never the names of victims she met with.
It turns out I myself needed that information!! I was beefing verbally abused by a man who was coming to the Gospel Meetings of another sister worker and myself. This man’s name was Vince and he was very high profile. NO OTHER WORKER GAVE ME ANY HELP WITH THIS!!!
Judy shared with me that she had prayed that if she was unable to continue this work within the Work that she would leave it. (This resonated with me, until I was put out of the Work for the work that I was doing… and since then as well.). I have VERY VERY VERY often thought of her in the last 23 years, wondering how she was doing/coping.
How can I get in touch with her please???
Marg Meyer/Magowan
Hi Marg. This is Sharon Lennox. Have often thought of you and how unfairly you were treated.
So here we are. The older brothers – I refuse to call them overseers as that gives them authority and power they should NOT have – are making one misstep after another. It seems that this occurrence of Judy leaving will put a dividing line in the fellowship, there will be consequences. Those workers involved in this should be boycotted and doors should be closing to them.
All workers who are supporting abusers in ANY way do NOT have the Christ within. There is nothing Christlike in what they are doing. Seems to me that its -all about me – attitude they are displaying. Jesus never ONCE made anything all about HIM. It was all about His Father and His Fathers plan and purpose. When Jesus was attacked personally he never said a word. When His WORKS where attacked – which were His Fathers works – he defended it and was fiery. It was NEVER about himself.
These ‘workers’ have shown who and what they are. They have shown who they are really serving – and it is NOT God. These people are not walking in the light.
Thank you Sharon for letting me know who you are.😊. You and I are united now more than ever before, and that’s a good thing.😊
Mark, I found myself smiling at your witty presentation, despite the underlying chilling truths. I may not share some of your beliefs, but am surely appalled that people are still fighting to hang onto the counterfeit garments.
I’ve been continuing to attend meetings, trying to filter out the many untruths, hypocrisy, self-righteousness, erroneous theology, etc. hoping it would somehow change with time.
It will never change. Its foundation is based on lies. Very early on there was excommunication for speaking and believing truth, and nothing has changed. They continue to cover up even the origins of the fellowship. How can anyone call it “The Truth”? Such blatant hypocrisy.
Why will honest people not see the truth? How can one possibly believe God is in this fellowship given the attitude and actions of the “leadership”?
The CSA is a huge issue, but the fellowship has been corrupt in many ways from the beginning.
I pray that God will continue to shine His light on this corrupt organization.
I am grateful for the courage of those like Judy who stand for truth. I sat beside Judy at my grandfather’s funeral as a child years ago, and have fond memories of her gracious care.
TR
TR— “I’ve been continuing to attend meetings, trying to filter out the many untruths, hypocrisy, self-righteousness, erroneous theology, etc. hoping it would somehow change with time.”
TR, I was once you. I couldn’t let go of something that was so much a part of me for generations. It was, or it seemed to be, part of my DNA. It wasn’t just a religion, it was my identity. My wife stopped going. My kids stayed at home. I still went. First it was the bread and wine that I stopped partaking. Why the bread and wine? That is actually the part, the bread and wine, that is real and represents Jesus.
Next, I began to point out the obvious untruths, hypocrisy, self righteous behavior…
Finally, I gave into truth. Real truth. The truth that Christ was showing me as I changed and came out of the box I lived in for 50 years. I came out of the box I was born into. The box where my whole world existed and I no longer belonged.
I stopped going to meetings. I was like a fish on the land at first. Then God lead me to a much better place. A very joyful and peaceful place. I soon enjoyed beautiful worship with real people who respect God, praise Jesus Christ and live to be reunited with Him.
I now have the closest relationship with my wife that I have ever had. My family is reuniting and the relationships are growing stronger and more stable and real than ever before. God is truly great! No more of the erroneous theology.
No more of the preaching that doesn’t understand the culture in which the scripture was written. No more preaching that doesn’t know what the history was and why customs have changed. No more preaching that makes customs a religion. No more having to please man and fear the workers. No more HAVING to be at a meeting. God is first, love, along with peace and joy. That is real. And, I am glad to have found it. TR, you will find it to. You are on your way out of the box you have always lived in.
the box – there is no reply link to your comment, so I am replying to my own comment in hopes that you see it.
I know we are all on our own journey, but I would love to speak with you about your experience and your current fellowship. It seems impossible for me to overcome my biases and enjoy fellowship in a different way.
If you are interested, please let me know how I could reach out to you.
TR
TR, you noted, “I know we are all on our own journey, but I would love to speak with you”. TR, you are correct about a lot including, we are all on our own journey. I can be reached at 4thedake@gmail.com. I would love to hear more of your story and tell you mine. Life is good when it is pointed in the right direction.
This statement is very heartfelt and honest: “ I cannot be a part of a ministry that supports the pedophiles and continually ignores the victims of child sexual abuse and other forms of abuse”. When the decent people, who are actually trying to help others and then they leave leadership, who is left? The top (male ) leadership doesn’t want to be challenged by a caring, competent, strong and intelligent woman. This leaves a very stagnant and dangerous environment that will only get worse with time.
I agree… Judy’s departure is pivotal.
We are generally pretty good at getting accurate information but not so on the hotel story. So sorry to everyone. The cool part is that while I was flooded with contrary info all day being the public Admin here, it was all very kind and patient. Our readers are the best! Thanks so much to all!
So what IS the story? Something happened somewhere that caused Judy to abruptly leave the work. As they say – in false stories there is always a kernel of truth. And that kernel will be revealed in time.
x
😊
I definitely feel we need to know… and I feel she will be forthcoming when she feels ready. My experience is that it is very very very very overwhelming 😣😥😖 . But she will have way more liberty outside of the Work; she will continue to do what she does well, and she has incredible support.
This is way way way better for her and for us all.😊
I want to know the REAL story if possible Bruce… please.
Marg Meyer
It’s not disclosed yet according to someone close to Judy.
😊
Thank you Judy for making the choice that God has directed His people to make for many thousands of years. This choice is simply separation from evil. The Bible has many examples for we people to read, understand and comply with. Thank you for so clearly making your choice made. I’m sure God is pleased with you.
😊
Judy is truly a servant of God. Owning her mistakes, and doing better the next time.
I just got word that our “overseer” has made the EXTREMELY foolish decision to create PEDOPHILE MEETINGS in Washington State…guess Darryl is more a friend of the enemy, than the God of Heaven. God has made if VERY clear that HE is NOT happy with what these men have been doing for the past 80+ years in His name…and they have the arrogance to thumb their noses at God. What happened to ZERO TOLERANCE?? Obviously that was a ploy to pretend that He cared!!
Please, if anyone lives in Washington, or anywhere else that will help stand up to this ungodly behavior…send Darryl your thoughts: darryldoland@gmail.com
So twisted. This group ostracizes and rejects all Christ loving Christians in the world, yet welcomes in and gives special treatment to pedophiles. Sick.
would you be kind enough to describe what a pedophile meeting is? The term doesn’t make any sense to me. It’s nothing I’ve ever heard of? Is it suppose to be like a fellowship meeting, or for some other reason to meet with them?
Please see Overseer Glenn Gasser’s letter dated May 24, 2023 (posted on Wings) to the “Wisconsin Friends”. Gasser provides his definition of an appropriate ped meeting.
@observer. That is a powerful analogy that you bring out between perps and alcoholism, it is taught well in the ministry safe course. I am sure that like me you have met and had fellowship with former alcoholic who give their testimony of how after coming to Jesus they lost all desire for alcohol. I sure can’t say anything about that since I always thought it was icky, but I do have lots of other things that held sway over me that no longer appeal.
@Amen – a meeting where predators are allowed. But, supposedly no children – although I don’t believe what we are told any more.
“Zero Tolerance” – doesn’t mean what it’s supposed to mean, and different definitions are given. Darryl – “I didn’t mean no predators would be allowed, just that we wouldn’t tolerate the not reporting requirement piece of it”. Then, he changed to “Zero Tolerance” and it’s actually definition, and removed them all from every meeting.
Now we are waffling again…
ZERO means ZERO!! Or it’s supposed to, and should, and it’s expected!!
Anyone who loves the God of Heaven, will NEVER ask for a predator to attend a meeting. Because, BEFORE they would request it, they would RESEARCH the disease/addiction to see if it was SAFE. I have taken many classes through the years (because of my work), and they will NEVER be safe.
DO NOT COMPARE THIS TO ALCOHOLICS – Alcohol is a tool people use to try to not deal with life’s issues. Alcoholics can be rehabilitated.
Pedophilia – someone who chooses to force themselves onto another human, for the sake of self gratification, by breaking the victim to the point of destruction – therefore affecting their entire lives in a negative way. Pedophiles who have even ONCE touched another human, there is not ONE case where they have ever been rehabilitated, whether they claim they have sought God, or not. The 2% people hear about being “rehabilitated”, are only in the class of voyeurism – in otherwords, they have not actually TOUCHED the other person, only with their eyes by peeking through a window or a camera up their skirt type behavior.
In the Appleton Wisconsin area, the workers actually sent cult members into prisons to preach to peds and perps. After the peds got out of prison, they were placed in meetings with kids. Overseer Gasser explains in his letter dated May 24, 2023 that “spiritual support” is good for CSA types. His letter can be found on Wings. Crazy thought pattern Gasser has.
@Bucky.. it seems to me that it boils down to a case where some firmly believe that peds and perps are sinners for life, while others believe that there isn’t a sin that Jesus doesn’t have power over. The gospel I learned was that any man or woman who allowed Christ to come and dwell with them would be changed by him into a child of God. Of course any man or women that will not let Christ dwell within will continue in their human sinful ways, whether it is murder, CSA, ——, or just lying.
The issue is about the protection of children. Whether peds or perps are saved, that’s between them and God.
Jesus doesn’t save them before he changes them by coming to dwell within. Christ in you the hope of glory.
This isn’t really as complicated as some seem to think. The pragmatic, and loving, approach is to protect survivors and potential future victims from being around perpetrators – always and everywhere.
This has the convenient side effect of also protecting perpetrators from themselves. It’s not kind or loving to invite someone who can’t resist excessive alcohol to a bar. It’s not kind or loving to invite someone who can’t or won’t resist abusing, to an environment where they’re exposed to their preferred targets. (Clearly alcoholism and pedophilia aren’t equivalent problems in terms of their impact on others. But there might be a reasonable analogy in how to prevent further damage.)
I have never seen any discussion about the customary after meeting handshake. Very young children are encouraged and taught to shake hands with every adult in the meeting. This brings approval to the child from parents and admiration from all in attendance. And what does the child learn? “There are no boundaries on my body, it is okay for this person to touch me, and it is GOOD for this man to touch me.”
I can not even imagine what evil thoughts a pedophile would be thinking as he touches that child’s hand. This is a very harmful practice.
@Bucky – I would send his letter to the FBI
@Amen – we do not “believe that pervs and peds are ‘sinners for life”, they are PREDATORS for LIFE!! BIG HUGE DIFFERENCE.
@henoffour- I appreciate your sharing your vast experience in learning about this disease, and your passion to help the victims. I am sure that you believe like I do that our salvation is based on what God has done for us, not on what our human natures are. He has quickened us together with Christ, we have become His workmanship. In that way He has changed us from what we were. I understand you have learned much about predators. I am sure most studies are based on those who never knew the experience of being quickened with Christ. Unfortunately we are learning that some who have experienced that quickening have not continued and have reverted to their sinful natures. or perhaps they really never were quickened with Christ and faked it? So I am still mystified as to why you believe that Jesus has no power to change any human to become a child of God. Are we saying some natures we are born with are so bad He can’t change them? Do we really believe that our natures are better and so He can help us but not others? I hope not.
@Henoffour.
A pedophile meeting. Just think about it for a moment, is this not a GENIUS solution??
You can’t stop people meeting with one another, so why not let the pedophiles meet together? They can meet and have ‘fellowship’ with each other. These are all narcissists who probably dispise each other, so let them find pleasure in each other’s company. So long as no worker or other friends have act or part in it, then it will become irrelevant.
Irrelevance is what narcissists hate the most.
Apologies to Judy, the original author of this post that the discussion has become somewhat distracted. You have given your life to serving God and the weary and wounded along the way. You have been in the front ranks of the battle and now it is time to step back. May we all have the wisdom and courage to respond when God asks us to change our place in the battlefield.
@From Afar – I’m not trying to detract from Judy and her wonderful work. She too fought against pedophilia and abuse.
The only “meeting” the predators should be having is the fact that they are all having a ‘meeting of the minds’ by turning themselves into law-enforcement!!
The why not? – Because they are meeting in the name of the Truth, with the ministry’s permission…and we don’t want any association with people who don’t want God’s help, because they are SO arrogant, that they won’t even do the right thing and turn themselves in! Go start your own church, and make it only for predators.
Just sent this to Darryl:
I appreciate you trying to care for the souls of perpetrators. I appreciate you removing them from fellowship with vulnerable children and young adults. I understand you’re setting up meetings where only perpetrators gather. I’ve heard they’re doing this in California too.
Here are my concerns (BTW, I have both perpetrators & victims in my family):
Who will be the elder of these meetings?
Titus 1:5-9 “The reason I left you in Crete was that you might put in order what was left unfinished and appoint elders in every town, as I directed you. An elder must be blameless, faithful to his wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient. Since an overseer manages God’s household, he must be blameless—not overbearing, not quick-tempered, not given to drunkenness, not violent, not pursuing dishonest gain. Rather, he must be hospitable, one who loves what is good, who is self-controlled, upright, holy and disciplined. He must hold firmly to the trustworthy message as it has been taught, so that he can encourage others by sound doctrine and refute those who oppose it.” (bold & italics mine)
Imagine the neighbors getting wind that “a house church of pedophiles” meets next door. We are witnesses of Christ in the world. Certainly, all of us are sinners, but we’re not all sexual predators. Setting up a meeting of pedophiles spells disaster for me in our already beleaguered fellowship. Imagine the BBC article on that one!
I know more about the subject of perpetrators than I ever cared to. I’m all for perpetrators having fellowship. Might one-on-one visits be better?
A caring friend in Christ
@For This – thank you for writing to him. I know there are many people who are choosing ignorance over education on this subject, and they are whining to their overseers that “it’s not fair” or “it’s not right” when the predators are put out. We are NOT talking about perverts – ones who just look too long when someone’s behind goes by, or knows someone’s changing in a bathroom and goes to watch, or puts their phone under the edge of someone’s skirt in hopes they aren’t wearing underwear!
We are talking about predators. Wolves. Wolves is what Jesus referred to them as, because they tear at, bite, thrash, maime, and kill all for their own pleasure. Destroying God’s child without a care.
These people are not “just sinners” who need God’s help. They NEED prison, so they won’t have opportunity to reoffend or to seek new victims.
Fellowship – one on one? As long as no children or women are ever included in those one on one visits (even if the husband is along, or a brother worker – because they CAN NOT be exposed to potential victims). Love them enough to say, “NO, stay away”. If they truly want get right, they will CHOOSE to stay away – for the rest of their lives. People need to have FAITH that God will keep ANY & EVERY soul who becomes HONEST, and wants His help…no matter where they are. Attendance in meetings does NOT equate going to heaven.
Amen, March 14, and 15:
As we are so touched by Judy’s letter as she informs she is stepping aside from the 2×2 ministry and will NOT be a part because it is supporting pedophiles and ignoring who they abused and other types of abuse. After spending decades of her very life protecting and supporting victims from her very own co-workers; while she ministered the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth that Jesus preached in his flesh in/to Israel for 31/2 years, this is a hard and life changing event. We are waiting to hear, what drove Judy from her position of ministry and advocate. As she explains her health is good – ministry is dear to her heart and has been glad to labor. What ‘ultimatum’ was she given, that she could NOT submit to; to remain?
Evidently, Amen, by your analogy; the peds and perps are not even saved! BUT they are MINISTERS!? So ‘overseer’s’ are protecting ministers who are “not even a child of God”! AND then try to destroy Judy who is a “minister” at least to those whom the “not even a child of God”: has criminally, emotionally, and mentally destroyed.
Your quote of “Christ in you the hope of glory” comes from the Pen of Paul in his letter to his church in Colosse: Paul only sends his letters to ‘believers’ in his gospel of the Grace of God as he dispenses the “dispensation of the Grace of God” which was given to him ‘to you ward’. Ephesians 3:7 Wherefore, I was made a minister, according to the “gift” of the grace of God ’given unto ME by the ‘effectual working of his power’. Verse :2 explains what Gospel Paul was given by – verse :1 by Jesus Christ, risen from the dead, sitting at the right hand of God, in heaven.
This ‘gospel Paul was given to reveal’ was ‘unsearchable’ :8. Verses :3, :4, :9 explain it as “the mystery” – which from the beginning of the world HATH been hid ‘in God’. Therefore, the Gospel of the Grace of God could not, and was not preached by Jesus nor his 12 apostles; as God, the Son had not yet revealed the knowledge in the ‘mystery of Christ’ :4.
Jesus and the 12 preached the Good News = Gospel that had been prophesied and foretold since Abram’s covenant by God of the Nation of Israel’s promised, covenanted Kingdom of Heaven on Earth. Jesus began teaching and ministering in Matthew 4:17, :23 IS NOW AT HAND(Your King is in your midst).
God even reveals through the pen of John; what John was shown by many angels::: Revelation 20: 4 – :7 describe earthly ‘kingdom’ for a 1000 years as Jesus promised the 12 in Matthew 19:28 and Luke 22:28 – :30 is reality for the 12 – :4. Then Rev. 21:1 – :as the “New Jerusalem “coming down out of Heaven is a very physical earthly kingdom :14 is beyond our ability to imagine God’s Holy city on a NEW EARTH for all eternity for ALL who come to Israel’s promised Heavenly Kingdom of God on a NEW Earth :1. There are two dwelling places for all eternity; A new Heaven and a New Earth.
Let me add that a worker from Doyle Smith’s new leadership area was going to California for Special Meetings and he was asked to attend the ministry safe course as an admission to California and the meetings. He declined and was still admitted into the state for the meetings. Does this sound like someone who really cares about victims? All of the workers from California we were told attended the course. Maybe all workers should try and cooperate at least to the very simple requests. But that is probably asking too much for those who just don”t care. Some just need to disappear.
@PD – That’s really sad, that any worker would choose not to take a class that just helps you recognize the behavior. Makes me wonder if they aren’t misbehaving, and don’t want to learn more about something they have a hand in?
I’ve lost all trust in every single overseer. It’s just one lie after another. We need them (overseers) ALL gone. Then, the congregation can decide what to do with the others. I know there are some that are honest and sincere in their calling. They aren’t letting their time in the ministry (having authority) go to their heads. But, most who are honest already left, because they cannot support criminal behavior. I really don’t know if there’s a way to fix this. I’m trying to have patience in God’s work. I think the majority of those still in the ministry just want to put their heads in the sand, pretend none of this happened, and rail on those who want it fixed. I do not agree that God created THIS Ministry, I think He is trying to show us NOW that this is NOT something He is happy with. This ministry was constructed by a few men, and reconstructed with more men, and all the while they were reconstructing…they were fighting and arguing. That’s not of God. Some claim the Gospel “prospered” – really?! This is the fruit God was looking for? I don’t think so!!! PS 37 says something to the effect of not fretting over those who SEEM to be prospering IN THIER OWN WAY – that’s not God’s way.
Maybe that is why the Bonners Ferry, Idaho convention owners decided to not hold the event this year. In their letter at Exposing Abuse: 2x2s on Facebook dated March 15, 2024, the owners cited “lack of transparency” regarding the CSA crisis and did not want to take the risk of additional CSA occurring at their property.
Judy thanks for doing all you could to rebuild trust in this church while a minister. I hope you will have even more success moving forward with your endeavors. It is sad as a minister you did not feel the support you needed. You were an amazing help to my husband‘s family for many years and got them through some very difficult things not related to CSA. I wish you the best.
We are from Washington State, and have confirmed Daryl Doland is not setting up fellowship meetings for pedophiles to attend. Whoever posted this in the comments, please know this is not accurate information and please correct the information to those you have shared this inaccurate information with.
I am aware that Wings is trying to correct this information. Thank you for all you do in working to provide us with accurate information.
We too all have to be careful what we assume when we hear/read things. Sometimes our sources are not reliable. We have learned this lesson ourselves over and over.
Bucky- please report the information about Gasser to the FBI , and his letters.
Also, whoever knows about the situation with Doyle Smith, allowing a worker to go speak and travel without having the ministry safe training please share their names and the situation with the FBI as well.
Overseer’s told us all ministers would be required to do the ministry, safe training.
We reported the above to the FBI along with several other CSA and financial misdeeds that we experienced after decades in the cult – I hope that everyone reports every wrong that has occurred to them so that the FBI has overwhelming information that can be turned over to law enforcement. This corruption has gone on long enough.